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Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sat May 09, 2009 1:29 pm

MyNetsForLife wrote:Does anyone know about Boozer's injury history? Does he have any chronic problems that could cut his seasons or career short?



Why would they take on Simmons for another year, just so they could get Anderson and swap first rounders? Wouldn't they be better off letting Boozer walk so they could re-sign Milsap?


Boozer has a $12.2 million player option. He doesn't have to do anything. He can opt to stay for a year and go into the 2010 free agent pool. If he does, it would make signing Millsap (and Okur who also has a player option) this summer virtually impossible for the Jazz, doubly so because the Miller family may want to sell the team...and you don't want to load up any company with future commitments if you're thinking of selling.

Boozer wants an extension of his contract. Again, that's why players want a player option at the end of their contracts, so they can negotiate an extension, as Carter did two years ago. Carter gave up $3 million on the first year of his extension but got a lengthy guarantee.

It is to Utah's great advantage to get anything of value for him now. Again, as noted, when teams are forced to get rid of superstars (and he qualifies), they don't get return value. They get future value, in terms of cap space, young player(s) and draft pick(s) in some combination. It's what the Lakers got for Shaq, what the Heat got for Shaq, what the Grizzlies got for Gasol, what the Raptors got for Carter, what the Nets got for Kidd, etc., etc. Some deals work out better than others.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby Brooklyn Nets? » Sat May 09, 2009 1:55 pm

People may say Boozer would not walk away from 12 million, but maybe he wants a long contract now, not in 2010 when he will not be the top guy on anyones radar.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby Dumpy » Sat May 09, 2009 2:40 pm

The Nets are legitimately only a couple of players away from being a true force, and the acquisition of Boozer would put them very close, I think. The question is how many picks it would take to make the deal work. Simmons + (Yi/Ryan/Sean) plus . . . what? If you could get away with tossing in one pick, then I think it is a really good deal for the Nets. Three picks . . . no way. Two picks? Not sure. Maybe you have to haggle over protection of the picks to agree to it.

Also depends on how much money you have to sign Boozer to, of course. A three-year escalating deal that starts at $10 million would be pretty reasonable, I think.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby Nets4Life » Sat May 09, 2009 4:31 pm

I don't see the Jazz making a swap for Lee. He plays the same position as Milsap...no way the Jazz want to put the 10+ million for Lee + 7-8+ million to re-sign Milsap, both long term contracts. They definitely HAVE to re-sign Okur, because Krylo isn't going to cut it.

I can see us sending Simmons+RA+Hassell+2 picks for a signed Boozer (probably going to command 14-15 million).

Once again, the wildcard in ALL/ANY of our potential trades this off-season will be MIAMI, simply because they have Beasley and a few sizeable expiring deals (Blount/Haslem) and thus can/will outcompete us on any deal (oh and they have Wade and South Florida to sway any of the stars their way). So whatever rumors float around this off-season, say for Amare, Bosh, Boozer, etc. keep in mind we don't have enough to out compete Miami, unless we overpay with draft picks.

If Miami just offered Beasley+Blount/Haslem+James Jones for Boozer...end of conversation.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sat May 09, 2009 4:55 pm

Oh please, there is NO way Miami is offering Beasley to ANYONE. Riley himself said that this week.

Beasley is 20 years old and averaged nearly 20 ppg at the end of the year.

And ONCE AGAIN, how many picks can Miami offer? In today's economy, draft picks are highly valuable, because they permit teams to hire cheap labor. Luckily the Nets have five first rounders over the next three years. In 2004-05, before the Carter deal, the Nets had six...three of their own and three others...over the next three years. They wound up keeping four.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sat May 09, 2009 5:44 pm

Here's another possibility: Boozer and Pelinka are making informal calls on a number of GM's to guage interest...and if it's there, to start suggesting ways to make a deal happen. Agents do that sort of thing, you know.

Now if I was driving from the Nets offices in East Rutherford to the Knicks offices in Greenburgh, NY, isn't the mall on the way?
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby BedouinBob » Sat May 09, 2009 6:05 pm

pegs wrote:Well, supposedly, he did lie to a blind man. I would say it's a good possibility.


First, cool scoop Psycho...glad you made the move to chat him up (you could be one-upping all the beat reporters).

But if the Nets are focused on "character guys", Boozer is the furthest thing from it.

As a former Cleveland resident, I can't look past the way he handled himself in that departure(I just happened to be in town when the Utah deal went down and the town was crazed with hate for him).

For those interested, here a few links to see just how he manipulated the Cavs to let him become a restricted free agent one year early (when the Cavs could have had him for the season at around $695,000)...and how he used that "gift of trust" to sign with the Jazz at a number the Cavs couldn't match.

He is as hated in Cleveland as VC is in Toronto -- maybe more.

An article that labels Boozer "one of the five worst traitors in sports"

http://www.fannation.com/si_blogs/for_t ... osts/16321

An article that describes how the firm that was Boozer's agent FIRED HIM as a client and forfeited their share of the contract with Utah.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/w ... index.html

An article from last month describing Boozer's choices and Utah's choices...hinting that Utah does not intend to offer him an extension; the article is titled: Carlos Boozer: The Two-Faced, Master Manipulator. Whats Next For Utah?

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1589 ... t-for-utah

An article from a Cleveland writer about how Boozer is still being treated when he comes to Cleveland:

http://www.cleveland.com/livingston/ind ... ill_f.html

An article that tries to take an inpartial view of how the whole situation went down at the time.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=1848196

No doubt, as a player on the floor, Boozer would be make the Nets instantly credible in the East. As for his total impact on the franchise...IMO...no thanks.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby soul driver » Sat May 09, 2009 6:21 pm

what a scoop Psycho, very cool to hear you got to meet a player and have a convo with him!

as for this happening or not...
I see Boozer playing in Miami, possibly. wasn't there some speculation (that's a keyword, of course) that he may want to play there?

I'm with Bob about Boozer's personality...one would expect better from a former Duke product (again, that's just based on assumption that Duke's program produces good quality kids- this isn't always true) .

However, on the court, if we can have Boozer without giving up VC- wow, that'd be quite impressive. We may have one of the better starting lineups in the East...and if we start Dooling at the 2 and VC at the 3...dare I say we'd have one of the top 3 starting lineups in the East?

I'm still not crazy on his on and off injuries though.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby PsychoNetsFan34 » Sat May 09, 2009 10:05 pm

Thanks for the praise guys. Maybe I should have tried to sell the story to one of the papers lol. Actually as a journalist major it was a cool first step to what interviewing someone would feel like. On your points about his personality and being a traitor, I only spoke with him for 10-15 minutes but from that he seemed like a really respectable guy and a class act. Now this might not be true, but like I said from the time I spent with him he seemed like a class act. Maybe he was just trying to impress a fan so I can buy his jersey when he comes to play for NJ ;) .
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sat May 09, 2009 10:07 pm

Hardly a character flaw when you look out for yourself and add $20 million to your income. New opportunities presented themselves and he took advantage of them. Nothing he did was illegal, nothing he did was outside the collective bargaining agreement. The Cavs didn't sue him and by the way, the Cavs seem to be doing just fine without him.

He is 27 years old...and if healthy (a big if in three of the last five years) he can be a 20 and 10 guy. How many of those are there in the NBA? Four? Five? He averaged 20.6 and 13.2 in the first round against LA.

He is also one of two NBA players to have an NCAA championship and an Olympic gold medal...Carmelo Anthony is the other. He has been a winner.

I could care less what he did in a business negotiation. He didn't get arrested for smoking dope, killing his chauffeur, throwing a computer, stealing laptops or beating up his wife.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sat May 09, 2009 10:08 pm

PsychoNetsFan34 wrote:Thanks for the praise guys. Maybe I should have tried to sell the story to one of the papers lol. Actually as a journalist major it was a cool first step to what interviewing someone would feel like. On your points about his personality and being a traitor, I only spoke with him for 10-15 minutes but from that he seemed like a really respectable guy and a class act. Now this might not be true, but like I said from the time I spent with him he seemed like a class act. Maybe he was just trying to impress a fan so I can buy his jersey when he comes to play for NJ ;) .


I suspect it will get picked up. See NetsDaily blog. :)
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby PsychoNetsFan34 » Sat May 09, 2009 10:45 pm

NetIncome wrote:
I suspect it will get picked up. See NetsDaily blog. :)


Thanks for the section in the article.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby GMJ » Sun May 10, 2009 12:05 am

NetIncome wrote:Hardly a character flaw when you look out for yourself and add $20 million to your income. New opportunities presented themselves and he took advantage of them.


I don't know...I would consider lying to a blind man to give yourself 20 million dollars a pretty big character flaw.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby Kid Chocolate » Sun May 10, 2009 12:56 am

The guy just happened to be blind. He didn't take advantage of his blindness, too much gets made out that he lies to a "blind man". Maybe if he agreed to write his own contract for $40 million and then wrote $60 million on it instead and it got signed because the blind guy couldn't read it...

And who knows what really went down. Boozer denies that there was a "handshake agreement", and has said he was going to sign with the Cavs until the Jazz made the offer. The Jazz couldn't have had an agreement with Boozer before that, because that would be tampering.

I do find the fact that his representation fired him over this VERY telling though.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby mb4th » Sun May 10, 2009 1:43 am

Doesnt everyone worth millions have a house in NJ? Maybe were reading too much into it.

I would deal Simmons, Anderson, our 1st( unless its top 3 of course) and the Mavs 1st(Can we protect it?) for Boozer, Price and their 1st
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby Nets4Life » Sun May 10, 2009 1:46 am

NetIncome wrote:Oh please, there is NO way Miami is offering Beasley to ANYONE. Riley himself said that this week.

Beasley is 20 years old and averaged nearly 20 ppg at the end of the year.

And ONCE AGAIN, how many picks can Miami offer? In today's economy, draft picks are highly valuable, because they permit teams to hire cheap labor. Luckily the Nets have five first rounders over the next three years. In 2004-05, before the Carter deal, the Nets had six...three of their own and three others...over the next three years. They wound up keeping four.


Before you discount my opinion, remember that Riley was never high on Beasley to begin with...he's probably just trying to inflate his trade value...if the right package comes along for a bona fide all-star, it will get done. Only a fool would believe every word an NBA GM says.

End of the year=garbage time.

ONCE AGAIN, lets all be honest with ourselves: all 5 first rounders will be outside the lottery, at the best late lottery, and at the worst we have only 4 picks (if GS continues to mismanage its team). This is not football where all first rounders have significant value. In a bad economy sure draft picks are cheap labor, but if you want to look at the current value of draft picks, look at what a late 1st rounder got for OKC this year, they obtained a rotation player (with potential) in Thabo, who boasts a career average of 5pts 3rbs. And for someone like Kevin Pritchard, late first rounders can be had with the swipe of a pen on his checkbook. Please stop over-hyping our picks...sure its great to add mid-round 1sts as a throw in to make trades happen, but the "meat" has to be there. The only "meat" we have to offer is expiring contracts and there are other large expiring contracts this year (for players who can do a LOT more than shoot an occasional 3-pointer from the corner).
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sun May 10, 2009 8:49 am

Rather than boldface your comments, be honest. Riley wasn't high on him? He picked him #2! Your comment (that he wasn't high on him) is subjective. Riley's action (taking him second in the strongest draft in years, if not decades) is the objective reality. He said it again yesterday--Beasley isn't available.

In writing about Thabo Sefolosha, Why post his career stats before joining OKC when you should be noting what he did after the trade, how his performance justified Presti's faith in him and his decision to send one of his THREE first round picks to Chicago? That's the value of stockpiling picks.

No one knows where those picks will be.... The Nets could have two lottery picks next year, for all we know. The Warriors pick could be as high as #11 in 2012 if it is transferred in 2011. I suggest you go back and count the number of lottery picks the Lakers and Heat got for Shaq in those two deals, the Raptors got for Carter, the Bulls got for Curry, the Grizzlies got for Gasol, the Nets got for Kidd. Some were, some weren't. The Mavs pick looks better every day. It didn't matter much how many of them were lottery picks. They were the reason why teams made those deals. They took chances.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby NetIncome » Sun May 10, 2009 9:12 am

Kid Chocolate wrote:I do find the fact that his representation fired him over this VERY telling though.


Also, a business decision. Agents, particularly those with large numbers of clients, realize that they need better long term relations with teams as much as they do with players. Players come and go. Teams are always there.

As noted above, I think what is going on is that Boozer and his agent are testing the waters around the league before making their decision on his option and maybe even suggesting deals. It is possible that the Jazz have quietly given Pelinka permission to try to put together a deal...that avoids the possibility of tampering. He can then return to Salt Lake and say Carlos is interested in Team X and here's what they say they're willling to offer. The teams can take it from there. Bigger the player, the most likely the agent is involved. (Last year, the Bulls gave Larry Hughes' agent the right to approach teams, leading to the rumors of a possible Nets trade and ultimately the trade that sent him to the Knicks. Agents will sometimes leak the possible deal to a friendly reporter so it gains traction in the fan base.

Everything I have read on Boozer since PsychoNetsFan34 posted says there is NO way Millsap and Boozer are coming back next season and that the Jazz is pretty tired of Boozer and loves Millsap.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby GrandKenyon6 » Sun May 10, 2009 9:42 am

Whether or not the man is blind is completely irrelevant to anything.

If you have an opportunity to be set for life and for your kids to be set for life, you take it, no matter what the situation is.
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Re: Had Lunch With Carlos Boozer Today...

Postby BedouinBob » Sun May 10, 2009 12:18 pm

grandkenyon6 wrote:Whether or not the man is blind is completely irrelevant to anything.

If you have an opportunity to be set for life and for your kids to be set for life, you take it, no matter what the situation is.


No one can argue with the concept of making a lot more money if you get the chance.

The fact is, the Cavs DID HIM A FAVOR and made it possible for him to become a free agent. They did not have to make him a free agent. They had him for another year for $695,000. When Boozer gets alternate offers once he becomes a free agent, he could have gone back to the Cavs -- if he really wanted to stay -- and explain the situation, and start a new negotiation with them. Clearly the Cavs showed good faith in the process.

Instead of Boozer coming clean, he insists that there was no handshake. Why on earth would the Cavs give a guy his free agency -- when it was clearly not to their advantage -- and let a 20/10 guy like Boozer walk?

Well, it was stupid. The GM got fired. But the owner...a classy guy in Gordon Gund...was quite disturbed by what happened. And I think it is symptomatic of what is wrong with sports and this country -- it's all about greed. And the concept of trust -- well you get burned when you actually try to do the right thing.

Boozer did the best thing for himself...LeBron publicly said at the time that Boozer had to do what was best for Boozer. It just is a very bitter pill to swallow that he had to resort to deception and trickery to make it happen...instead of living with the contract he signed and making the big bucks when it was his time.

As for the Cavs doing ok without Boozer...who knows? Imagine Lebron and Boozer maturing together...and combining with Z, having the best 3/4/5 combination in the league, bar none.

I actually think NetIncome is right in the end. When they got rid of a "me first" guy in Boozer...and surrounded LeBron with quality, character guys...they've got a much better chance to win an NBA championship with a team oriented philosophy.
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